Coronavirus Thread

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Alpha111
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by Alpha111 »

scissortooth wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 10:01
@Alpha111

I'm sort of with you in terms of arguments, but I don't think you need to be that hostile. I know some people can be really dumb about this Covid thing but most guys here - Jackie too - are just having doubts to the degree that I think is still reasonable, even if I disagree with them. Also, Jackie said clearly that in spite of his doubts he still follows the rules. Let's not get too much blood in the head.
Yeah, walked about 2 of the comments. I'll save those for later.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by ~svenhair »

Better than nothing. Cotton masks are pretty far down the list as fact as effectiveness though. The science is clear on that one. Any material that absorbs moisture loses its ability to clean electrostatically, which is a key metric as to why poly tests better.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by mco666 »

kensrs wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 01:14
mco666 wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 00:15
Sorry for my bad English, but I can't think straight at the moment. I don't know around the world, but here in Brazil it seems that somehow hospitals profit from the misfortunes of others. My mother, who is taking care of herself because she is in the risk group, didn’t travel or anything and after raining, she got sick, tired, which is one of the symptoms, so I took her to the hospital and they just took her to the emergency room and they didn't say anything to me. After that, I didn't see her anymore, I just talked to her through messages and she said she had an x-ray and that they said the problem is in the lung and she was transferred to the hospital that takes care of covid and that until now she haven't been tested for covid and the doctors want leave her hospitalized. And now i'm scared if it is something else she is at risk of really becoming infected with the disease and making something much worse
sorry man, hope she is released soon and OK
My biggest fear is my parents catching it
Thank You. She took the test today and they took her to another hospital to await the result and her recovery.
Brazil is so bad that they are putting anyone with symptoms or something in the lung in the same place with people infected with Covid. I had acquaintances of mine who had pneumonia or emphysema and were left in the same room as those who have covid. And there are people dying for other things and they are blaming the covid. It's unfortunate.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by Jackie Treehorn »

~svenhair wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 14:34
Better than nothing. Cotton masks are pretty far down the list as fact as effectiveness though. The science is clear on that one. Any material that absorbs moisture loses its ability to clean electrostatically, which is a key metric as to why poly tests better.
That would be due to particles affected by Brownian Motion. This is the reason that sterile air filters don't function properly when wet.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by Jackie Treehorn »

Alpha111 wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 09:06
Jackie Treehorn wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 07:11
Alpha111 wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 02:39
For those that think masks have no effect: https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/full/10.7326/M20-6817

Someone has already done the research for you. However, this is written at a pretty high reading level so if you need crayons or pop up pictures added, just let me know.
Um.. you did read the results and conclusion, right? The study is basically inconclusive.
Did you cherry pick 2 sentences out of the results? It says that masks did not reduce infection rates by 50%. Correct. The whole study was sponsored by the Danish Government looking at if there was a *significant* change in cases through masks alone with the threshold being 50%. If you read the results section or the actual paper, it reduced it by up to 46% so they can't say it has a *significant* effect. Spoiler: Denmark still mandated masks and has some of the lowest case numbers. It also states that these numbers are combined with a degree of social distancing which isn't happening in the US at this point. It says that masks *alone* are not enough.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33273115/ 47% reduction in cases
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7730488/ observational study relating to the wearing masks and reduction of transmission rates
https://msphere.asm.org/content/5/5/e00637-20 Masks provide protection and a reduction in risk although they are not 100% perfect
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/artic ... ne.0237691 Mask and Social Distancing = less cases
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 2720300117 Mask and Social Distancing = less cases, even if its just a t shirt over your face
https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... nce_Review masks are cheap and lower transmission rates
https://www.pnas.org/content/117/36/21851.short Mandatory mask wearing reduces cases better than voluntary mask wearing
https://www.healthaffairs.org/doi/full/ ... 2020.00818 US states that made people wear masks had less cases

Edit: Sorry if I come across a bit rude, just getting tired of people not doing the simplest shit to end this pandemic. And I am tired of places like Germany where I live doing the right thing for it not to matter because none of our neighbors are doing the right thing.
I didn't cherry pick anything. I think you're misinterpreting the data. "Infection with SARS-CoV-2 occurred in 42 participants recommended masks (1.8%) and 53 control participants (2.1%). The between-group difference was −0.3 percentage points" This is from a total of 3030. That means with masks 1.8% and without 2.1% infection. The 47% is referring to the CI (confidence interval), not the real infection rate. The study results clearly states "the difference observed was not statistically significant"

The second Jena study read more like a newspaper article than a scientific study. Primarily because it wasn't a scientific study but an observation of Jena not taking any other factors into account such as lockdowns, distancing and the suspension of public transport.

I'm not inclined to waste my time reading further because it's rather clear to me that you haven't read the studies but did a rather rapid search of study headlines and banged them into a response here. I'm sorry you came across as rude too. We do have a few things in common though. We're both in Germany and we're both tired of petty bullshit. As for Germany's neighbors Covid deaths per millions in the last 7 days: Poland 33.8, Austria 34.6, Denmark 28.2, France 26.7, Switzerland 52.28, Czech Republic 85.3, Germany with 58.2. So Germany is in third to last place when compared to it's neighbors. Link The Czech Republic is interesting in regards to it's mask policy because it was initially one of the most stringent countries regarding masks and then we look at Sweden which had no mask or lockdown policy (except just recently for public transport and at peak hours) and see that it's rate increased at almost the same rate and is at least in the last 7 days lower than Switzerland, Germany or the Czech Republic. So hurrah to Germany for doing the right thing.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by kensrs »

mco666 wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 19:08
kensrs wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 01:14
mco666 wrote:
08 Jan 2021, 00:15
Sorry for my bad English, but I can't think straight at the moment. I don't know around the world, but here in Brazil it seems that somehow hospitals profit from the misfortunes of others. My mother, who is taking care of herself because she is in the risk group, didn’t travel or anything and after raining, she got sick, tired, which is one of the symptoms, so I took her to the hospital and they just took her to the emergency room and they didn't say anything to me. After that, I didn't see her anymore, I just talked to her through messages and she said she had an x-ray and that they said the problem is in the lung and she was transferred to the hospital that takes care of covid and that until now she haven't been tested for covid and the doctors want leave her hospitalized. And now i'm scared if it is something else she is at risk of really becoming infected with the disease and making something much worse
sorry man, hope she is released soon and OK
My biggest fear is my parents catching it
Thank You. She took the test today and they took her to another hospital to await the result and her recovery.
Brazil is so bad that they are putting anyone with symptoms or something in the lung in the same place with people infected with Covid. I had acquaintances of mine who had pneumonia or emphysema and were left in the same room as those who have covid. And there are people dying for other things and they are blaming the covid. It's unfortunate.
hoping shes negative and back home soon :)
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by ~svenhair »

CCP arrests an Australian journalist who dares to tell the truth. Chilling

https://youtu.be/xUsntuFS3EY
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by SuperStylist »

~svenhair wrote:
08 Feb 2021, 12:49
CCP arrests an Australian journalist who dares to tell the truth. Chilling

https://youtu.be/xUsntuFS3EY
You need to stop spreading baseless consistency theories. Trump is gone and even Qanon have started to backtrack. Wake up sunshine!
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by SuperStylist »

Also, sort out your racist avatar picture while you’re at it.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by SuperStylist »

Obviously I’m joking! What’s happening with the concentration camps over there is terrible. The cold hard truth is that 4 years of clowning around has hugely weakened the USA as a global super power. Many around the world are saying that America is done and that people like Germany and France are looking to China as the next global powerhouse. Unfortunately, I think it’s only going to get harder to challenge Chia on human rights. Let’s not forget Kids in cages on the US southern boarder, I feel like the US lost some moral high ground due to that cruel tragedy.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by ~svenhair »

Nothing against China, just hate the evil that is the CCP. My Chinese and Singapore friends do too. Comparing holding areas made of chain link fence during the Obama years to 500+ concentration camps is madness though.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by scissortooth »

SuperStylist wrote:
08 Feb 2021, 18:57
Obviously I’m joking! What’s happening with the concentration camps over there is terrible. The cold hard truth is that 4 years of clowning around has hugely weakened the USA as a global super power. Many around the world are saying that America is done and that people like Germany and France are looking to China as the next global powerhouse. Unfortunately, I think it’s only going to get harder to challenge Chia on human rights. Let’s not forget Kids in cages on the US southern boarder, I feel like the US lost some moral high ground due to that cruel tragedy.
You're not wrong. The erosion started back with 2nd Iraq war, though looking back I laugh at how GBushJr was made to look back then when people were unaware someone like Trump could actually become POTUS. Not that the former was my cup of tea, but at least he could still speak something more than a poorer version of Wikipedia Simple English and did not try to play a hamfisted version of Frank Underwood power play. But there was this whole Guantanamo thing, and other bases for doing technically illegal shit with suspected terrorists. Now, US may have lost its virginity a good bit earlier, but this was when it's naked pics with the family's dog went online, so to say.

Later there was the real estate market bubble and people were like "ah, so that's what the American Dream is really like". After a wave of internal and external criticism of the shit US was doing to stay on top (colabs with right wing South American regimes and the like) came a wave of internal criticism showing that USA is a country where the rich take good care of staying well above the poor, where they make sure the politicians vote the right way, and so on... It's what led to Trump too, though it's kind of funny if you are a sheep and you choose a hungry limp wolf to battle a whole pack of hungry wolves. And then came the images - China builds this, that, and speedy as fuck, while in the US you have all those pretty cities and crumbling infrastructure in the countryside. I can attest to keeping hearing of subsequent wonders China did while at the same time hearing people start having doubts whether USA is really as big as it has used to portray itself. USA sure lost its charm of the "land of opportunity" then. Next was also the questionable things like being good pals with Saudis with their export of radical Islam, not to mention to ever-present issue of perhaps turning too much of a blind eye to some of the stuff Israelis do at home. Then there was the Iran stuff. First the issue of pressing on them even when Europe had its reservations, then that thing with that one general killed, which was perhaps the right thing to do but doing it so openly was frowned upon. Like "man, even Putin tries to at least keep some plausible deniability when pulling off shit like that".

Previous to that, I felt that the spirit was "yeah, the US of A have their share of dumbasses, but at least they keep them away from running the country and on the whole they push that whole humanity thing in a sensible direction while sort of leading it". Nowadays no one would claim that USA is leading the world in anything. Soviet Union's main cards were the nukes and the international commie block, but in terms of cultural impact and trade power they were lacking. Also, they had Uncle Joseph as a bit of an image problem, the guy being often seen as just-a-tid-bit-liter version of the Adolf. Now, China is a different thing. Commies alright, at least in theory, but at least Mao kept the killing within the country so it's their own biz, right? Plus, it was them who were killed by nazi Japanese, not the other way round. Then you have the trade power. And the long-time western fascination with the Orient, the Far East. A culture that's thousands of years old and that used to dominate its region, if not the world, for centuries. Add to that the fact that they now have a tight grip on the whole freedom-of-speech stupidity&fakenews-related problem that we can't seem to solve in the West. They just did away with FoS altogether and most of their people are OK enough with it not to cause internal instability. USA was able to portray the Ruskies as bandits while they were the sheriff. Nothing like that is possible now with China. Especially considering that it would look kinda stupid when you basically used to feed that new devil in order to battle the old one.

Sure, USA is still a major player and who's on top now is a matter of debate, but I'd risk a claim that Russia has never came so close to pwning USA as China does now. And that USA has never had such a bad image as it has now. People are like "yeah, Chinese have their share of bad stuff, but doesn't USA have plenty of cadavers in the closet too?" Suddenly people start thinking of Hiroshima and Nagasaki and while they previously thought of that as a sad but necessary act aimed at ending the WW2, now they start thinking "huh, wasn't that terrorism/genocide too?"

IMHO, unless something changes a big way, the trajectory is not favourable to the USA. The Chinese have just as little problems as they used to, while the West handles unrest from social stratification, unrest from covid, unrest from fakenews and other online stupidity resulting from the issue of how much (not) to curb free speech. They also have the morale bonus from having risen from poverty and from feeling that they are returning to the their rightful place in the world. Also, they plan long-term, while the West seems to be all about the present nowadays, the next elections being always the priority.

Don't get me wrong, while I'm perhaps not a fan of democracy the way it's done in the US, I still like it in general. And while I think free speech should have some limits, I'm not a fan of the state having a tight grip over it. If you asked me what countries seem the best places to live - from social/political POV anyway - I'd name things like Iceland, New Zealand, Canada... Not USA, but not China either. My country is not the best either, but I never thought in my teenage and early young adult life that I'd say that I'd prefer staying in Poland to moving the the USA if I had a chance.

Phew, that's been quite a rant...

Also, all you US guys here - don't get me wrong, I'm not against you. I'm not living in the US and perhaps my vision of things is a bit skewed too. But I am quite certain that this kind of disillusionment I experienced is quite a common thing, here in Central Europe at the very least. We just don't look up to your country anymore, because it started looking just too much like every other squabbler out there. Whether the cause of it is the free flow of information or the mistakes of the people running your country - I'm not sure. But it sure as hell was not caused by some outside influence.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by SuperStylist »

~svenhair wrote:
09 Feb 2021, 02:59
Nothing against China, just hate the evil that is the CCP. My Chinese and Singapore friends do too. Comparing holding areas made of chain link fence during the Obama years to 500+ concentration camps is madness though.
I’m curious, regardless of which administration oversaw the building of containment areas, how do you feel about kids being permanently separated from their parents as a form of punishment without due process? Including children with Down’s syndrome? Not to mention the reports of forced sterilization (hysterectomies) performed on women. The filth and disease, the brutal neglect of young children’s basic needs while being held against their will indefinitely?

I’m genuinely curious how Trump supporters can justify these types of atrocities. I realize that the physical buildings were constructed by Democrats, don’t think I’m letting them off the hook here. But when it became public knowledge that these things were happening, my mind is blown by anyone who would go out and vote for more of it. At least the Chinese people didn’t participate in a democratic election and choose to vote for their government to commit human rights violations.

I know that many countries in the world are committing human rights violations, but just because someone else is doing it on a larger scale doesn’t make any of it ok.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by SuperStylist »

Republican mindset:

When we want to prevent any type of common sense gun control, “guns don’t kill people, people kill people.”

When we want to deter people from crossing our boarder, “It’s not the people separating families and locking up children who are to blame, it’s the guy who signed off on the construction of the building we are using to do it.”

In a nutshell, refusing to take responsibility for one’s actions while wildly accusing anyone else to deflect attention.

Bothsideism continues to be a huge problem. Refusing to take responsibility for one’s actions while shifting the focus to someone else’s shortcomings, thinking that get’s one off the hook.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by mercury22 »

No the Truth is: They governed people out of guns in Nazi Germany by saying, "We will take care of you & protect you"! Well, we know where that led to with Hitler Killing Jews, Gypsies, Black Folk & all undesirables first by intimidation of the Brownshirts (Just like on college campuses, interviews on the DNC state propaganda media & in the streets if you say anything that the Marxists that are leading the USA today disagree with...You are evil). IF one reads the Constitution the 2nd Amendment was to keep folks safe from the lawless & from a Government out of control. Most of our Forefathers dealt with a tyrannous British overlord government they fled to America to get out from under. When the British government tried to control the new land the Revolutionaries (Today we call them the American Patriots of the Revolution, then the Brits called them treasonous & many of the signers of our Declaration of Independence lost a lot to give us Freedom). READ our real History, not the the Revisionist history f the left. Sadly, the policies & plans of the left are very eerily similar to the plans of Nazi Germany (History repeating itself because the left is teaching inaccuracies & changing history to suit themselves...sounds like those that read the Bible & distort it to fit their lifestyle instead of it changing one's lifestyle).
Don't believe me? Ask the Holocaust survivors he lived it who have been warning us of the left policies are so similar to those that cost them their freedoms & cost them the lives of many families! My father said the same thing (God rest his soul as he died Dec. 30th, but said the same things...He asked what did I & the many fellow soldiers that died in WW II fight for when we accept Nazi policies he was sent to fight & keep out of America???) Again, just another politician & media ploy to sound good, but are really are a wolf wearing a sheep's mask for their own glory & power!!!
IF you lived in Texas, you would know the truth that under Trump Women & children trafficing went way way down! Children of which 90% were brought here by MS-13 & other Gang members were used to make them look like a family. Most of these children were separated from their parents before trying to enter the US. They were saved from being raped & used, unlike under the Obama Admin that saw many women & children abused in the cages He built & are expected tp see again under the new Admin. Most Hispanic folks in Texas & along the border were pleased that the Wall was built...I know, I serve these folks!!! WHY...because the illegals are forcing them to give money, shelter & holding many hostage to cover for bad people crossing (NO, not all are bad, but about 65-75% are bad causing much pain, abuse & a lot of death among Hispanic families) So, please get your facts right & do not repeat the DNC propaganda media who only showed a few folks caught in the separation process. But many women were forced to help in the Drug mules across the border & children too. If they did not comply, they were killed!!! Funny, the President of Mexico when closing their S. Border, they too saw a significant drop n criminal activity & greater productivity for Mexico...something you will not hear in the media!!!
By the way, at 62 I heard all the same "The sky is falling" mantra's when I was in grade school in Pennsylvania! NONE of them have come to pass, from overpopulation (I have been around the world & see a lot of areas to live that have all the resources...predictions made by those living in urban sprawl), to global cooling to global warming predictions, all the way to food shortages (We pay rich in the beltway loop farmers to not farm...could you imagine IF we paid them t produce & sent the food to the nations in need???). Sad, the Canadian Prime minister flogged this new administration for closing work on the pipeline...have you ever looked at the huge swaths of land torn up by raping the land to get the toxic chems needed to produce solar panels. Here in Texas, cattle graze among the pumps pulling oil from the land, there these areas of land will remain toxic. Or the 30 gallons of oil needed to run ONE Windmill each month, yes changed each month. Besides that they don't produce the energy needed!!! In Georgetown, Tx these charlatans convinced a Republican mayor, who convinced their city council & the good citizens to go all wind. Their average electric bills were $200. They were excited until they started getting their monthly bills...$1200 or more!!! And we are giving tax money (taxpayer money to school districts while heavily subsidizing this boondoggle!!! Guess what? After 10 years the folks that these things are on heir land are totally responsible for upkeep...they are stuck with these 100 foot hunks of metal!!!
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by Baldfan »

Mercury22, that $1200 increase is for the year not mostly. Still a sizable increase but just for accuracy sake.

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/01/29/ ... wer-bills/
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by SuperStylist »

It’s genuinely fascinating how right wing extremists in the US think that they are the rational ones and that main stream centrist politicians are the dangerous extremists. Remind me again who stormed the capital building?

Literally insane.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by scissortooth »

Guns are severely restricted in most of Europe and, guess what, no new Hitler yet. And they are not restricted because of some idea like "we will take care of you" but to avoid escalation. And it works, judging from how often someone is shot here and how often someone is shot in the US.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread

Post by SuperStylist »

scissortooth wrote:
10 Feb 2021, 09:33
Guns are severely restricted in most of Europe and, guess what, no new Hitler yet. And they are not restricted because of some idea like "we will take care of you" but to avoid escalation. And it works, judging from how often someone is shot here and how often someone is shot in the US.
Absolutely, it’s obvious to anyone who has spent time in other countries and to a lot of Americans to be fair. It’s the loonies who get the media coverage, we don’t hear about the majority of Americans who support many of the sensible measures taken by other developed (and many not so developed) nations. The problem is cultural isolationism in the US on top of a superiority complex. The irony is that some fringe extremists love to harp on about English tyrants and the war of independence, forgetting that the Queen of England has no political power while the President of the USA can go around personally pardoning more or less any criminal, as we saw with Trump rewarding criminal associates who remained loyal.

Just like in 1930s Germany, the supporters of the far right in the US are ironically and tragically afraid of the wrong people, while driving the real threat to democracy into power. Again, remind me who stormed the Capital building? Since they did that and clearly overstepped the line in almost everyone’s book, it makes it very easy to argue right and wrong.
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